Question: Do you believe in Eternal Security or Once Saved Always Saved?
38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.
Answer: Personally, I find the entire OSAS versus losing salvation (conditional security) to be ridiculous. OSAS teaches that the moment you “believe” then God does all these amazing things to you that cannot be undone but He was incapable of doing anything until you consented (believed). Conditional security teaches that the moment you believe and turn from your sins then God gives you “initial” salvation but not “final” salvation where you can end up not saved.
I will say at first that I do not agree with CS. I might sound like an OSAS believer but it is not my belief. My blog will certainly offer comfort to those who believe and teach OSAS/Eternal Security. I simply preach security and not to those that have done this thing called believing. Believing is how the security is enjoyed. Receiving is comprehending or beholding a reality. It is turning from LIES. If it is LIES then it was never a reality. Truth proclaims a reality.
I will say at first that I do not agree with CS. I might sound like an OSAS believer but it is not my belief. My blog will certainly offer comfort to those who believe and teach OSAS/Eternal Security. I simply preach security and not to those that have done this thing called believing. Believing is how the security is enjoyed. Receiving is comprehending or beholding a reality. It is turning from LIES. If it is LIES then it was never a reality. Truth proclaims a reality.
It amazes me how OSAS will accuse conditional security (CS) for making “believing” a work because CS claims you have to “continually” believe to be saved rather than believing for a brief moment. CS will ask OSAS:
“How is our believing any different from yours? You claim one must believe to get saved and we agree. We simply say you must continually believe to be saved and you say that you have to at some point believe to be saved. How is believing for a few moments not a work but believing more than a few moments is a work when we both require the same thing to be saved? We both are exercising the same believing but ours simply lasts longer, so at what point does believing that you claim one must DO turn into a work?
Let's say that you are right and that only an instant of believing is required then I still do not see how continuous believing is a work. You make the same claim, "Believing is REQUIRED to be saved" and again, we agree. If believing is how one gets saved then how will continuously believing have any other than the same end result than yours?
Will the gospel fail the one who continuously believes it? Is not that person still continuously believing the same message you claimed to have believed for a moment to be saved? It is odd that you claim that the man/woman believing the gospel will die and go to hell for continuously believing the gospel. You say you must believe to be saved and so do we, but how is exercising the exact same believing now a work? Are you saying that your 2 seconds of believing will result in heaven for you but 20 years of believing the same message would result in hell for us?
If one had to run 2 miles to win a prize but one man chose to run 30 miles then I think we would agree that the man who ran 30 miles did not need to go so far to win a prize, but the fact is, both men had to run to get the prize. The man who ran 30 miles won the prize a long time ago, so running an extra 28 miles would never undo the prize because the requirement was 2 miles to win.
5 seconds of believing or 5 years of believing is a distinction the bible does not make. It simply says in the present tense, "believe and be saved" and that is what we are doing. Our belief is that 30 miles was required to win the prize and not 2 miles, but to call our belief a work is as silly as claiming the man who ran 30 miles was running but the other who ran 2 miles never was running. If believing continuously is a work then obviously a few seconds is the same person on the same jogging track, as both are doing the SAME thing but one simply does it longer than the other.
The point is, the belief we believe one needs to exercise to be saved is the same as yours but that it simply lasts longer than just a few seconds. I think it is strange to say that we will go to hell for believing continuously the death, burial, and resurrection gospel. However, if 30 miles was required to be saved then what will happen to your man who only ran 2 miles? At least we can say, "We are believing the gospel" versus your man that stopped 28 miles ago.”
“How is our believing any different from yours? You claim one must believe to get saved and we agree. We simply say you must continually believe to be saved and you say that you have to at some point believe to be saved. How is believing for a few moments not a work but believing more than a few moments is a work when we both require the same thing to be saved? We both are exercising the same believing but ours simply lasts longer, so at what point does believing that you claim one must DO turn into a work?
Let's say that you are right and that only an instant of believing is required then I still do not see how continuous believing is a work. You make the same claim, "Believing is REQUIRED to be saved" and again, we agree. If believing is how one gets saved then how will continuously believing have any other than the same end result than yours?
Will the gospel fail the one who continuously believes it? Is not that person still continuously believing the same message you claimed to have believed for a moment to be saved? It is odd that you claim that the man/woman believing the gospel will die and go to hell for continuously believing the gospel. You say you must believe to be saved and so do we, but how is exercising the exact same believing now a work? Are you saying that your 2 seconds of believing will result in heaven for you but 20 years of believing the same message would result in hell for us?
If one had to run 2 miles to win a prize but one man chose to run 30 miles then I think we would agree that the man who ran 30 miles did not need to go so far to win a prize, but the fact is, both men had to run to get the prize. The man who ran 30 miles won the prize a long time ago, so running an extra 28 miles would never undo the prize because the requirement was 2 miles to win.
5 seconds of believing or 5 years of believing is a distinction the bible does not make. It simply says in the present tense, "believe and be saved" and that is what we are doing. Our belief is that 30 miles was required to win the prize and not 2 miles, but to call our belief a work is as silly as claiming the man who ran 30 miles was running but the other who ran 2 miles never was running. If believing continuously is a work then obviously a few seconds is the same person on the same jogging track, as both are doing the SAME thing but one simply does it longer than the other.
The point is, the belief we believe one needs to exercise to be saved is the same as yours but that it simply lasts longer than just a few seconds. I think it is strange to say that we will go to hell for believing continuously the death, burial, and resurrection gospel. However, if 30 miles was required to be saved then what will happen to your man who only ran 2 miles? At least we can say, "We are believing the gospel" versus your man that stopped 28 miles ago.”
I do believe OSAS and CS make believing a work. I believe the above illustrates how both truly are on the same jogging track but OSAS jumps off the track early and then accuses the other of jogging when OSAS clearly jogged at one point. I've seen OSAS accuse them of putting their trust in believing as to why they make it a work, but I see OSAS stating, "I know I am saved because on June 3rd, 1990, I BELIEVED the message and the bible says that whosoever BELIEVES shall be saved." Sounds the same to me as to what they are accusing CS of doing.
OSAS says that if you have BELIEVED at any point in your life then you are eternally secure. What do you think a person goes looking for to determine if they are saved or not? Looks as though they are looking to the day they have BELIEVED to me. Some even say that if you do not know the day and time you believed then you probably never believed to begin with and that sounds like trust in believing to me. Some even claim that if you were never fully persuaded then you never were saved. Some in the Free Grace camp claim that if your believing had any doubts in it concerning the gospel and being saved then you were never saved. This again to me sounds like a belief in their believing. It probably explains why so many repeat the erroneous sinner's prayer. It probably explains why many doubt if they believed enough or the right way. The fact that OSAS attacks me for preaching an already reality that we come to believe tells me that they see believing as a work one does to get something. In OSAS, you have to DO something to get something. No different that what CS believes and teaches. The only different is that CS extends the time limit on believing and OSAS complains about it. I see OSAS just as guilty as CS.
OSAS says that if you have BELIEVED at any point in your life then you are eternally secure. What do you think a person goes looking for to determine if they are saved or not? Looks as though they are looking to the day they have BELIEVED to me. Some even say that if you do not know the day and time you believed then you probably never believed to begin with and that sounds like trust in believing to me. Some even claim that if you were never fully persuaded then you never were saved. Some in the Free Grace camp claim that if your believing had any doubts in it concerning the gospel and being saved then you were never saved. This again to me sounds like a belief in their believing. It probably explains why so many repeat the erroneous sinner's prayer. It probably explains why many doubt if they believed enough or the right way. The fact that OSAS attacks me for preaching an already reality that we come to believe tells me that they see believing as a work one does to get something. In OSAS, you have to DO something to get something. No different that what CS believes and teaches. The only different is that CS extends the time limit on believing and OSAS complains about it. I see OSAS just as guilty as CS.
Religion is obsessed with the word saved. People hear the word saved and they immediately think about the afterlife and some hell/heaven to come. Start with the Old Testament and look up the words “salvation” and “saved.” Also, look up the phrase “shall be saved” in the Old Testament. You will discover that a physical salvation from a certain event on planet earth was implied or talked about. It could be one saved from pestilence, enemies, or even death. How is it that we go from saved as taught in the OT to saved from hellfire in some afterlife in the New Testament never once taught in the Old Testament? Maybe it is because religion has twisted our way of seeing certain verses.
Also, look up the word “perish” in the OT and then ask yourself, “How does “perish” now mean in some literal burning hell forever in conscience agony when the Old Testament never taught that?”
I do not want to repeat things I have already shared in my other blogs. I do want people to read scripture and ask, “Is this being saved in the afterlife or on planet earth?” If I preached to New Yorkers back in January of 2001 a prophetic message warning them about planes crashing into the Twin Towers and those believing my message will be “saved” versus those who reject the message and “perish” then it should be clear that I am talking about a physical salvation. Could it be possible that scripture was talking about a physical salvation in the NT? I shared a lot concerning this in my blog on Acts 2:38: Water Baptism? Baptism of Repentance? Acts 2:38?...
Look at Matthew 24:13:
13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
The above verse is used by religion to teach an after death salvation. CS believes the above verse teaches you can lose your salvation and go to some hellfire in the afterlife. Lordship Salvation teaches that one who does not endure to the end gives evidence that they never savingly believed at any moment. They claim that if one is truly saved then they will always endure to the end. A big clue that you are hearing a line of bologna from religion is when they give you an answer coming from NOTHING in the context or scripture.
What is saved in Matthew 24:13? The “he/she” is saved from the death and destruction talked about in the context. It had NOTHING to do with an after death experience and it certainly was not some hellfire in the afterlife nonsense. Look at verse 22 that clearly defines what is saved:
22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
We are talking about “those days” that I believe is past, but it clearly states, “no FLESH be saved” as it was a physical salvation. The verse was not even addressing you!
Physical salvation could be lost. If I warned about impending doom of 9/11 back in 2001 and my initial believers later rejected my message then they would have perished in the Twin Towers. If they have believed me then they would have never perished or died. Look at Hebrews 10:38-39:
39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.
What amazes me is how many see the above referring to an after death experience in hell inside a book that never once talked about hell.
The drawing back addressed Jews who were returning to the sacrificial system. The context was them returning back to the Temple but these Jews needed to hear, “there remains NO MORE sacrifice for sins” (verse 26) as the author of Hebrews made that clear throughout chapter 10. There remains no more sacrifice for sins (vs. 26) because there truly was no more “offering for sin” (verse 18). Jesus offered His body as the once for all sacrifice (vss. 10, 12).
These Jews needed to know that going back to the Temple was to trodden underfoot the Son of God in order to do so. In order to go back to the old system would require them to stomp right over Jesus Christ and His sacrifice to get back to the sacrificial system.
These Jews were warned in chapter 6 that such a repentance is “impossible” but the context states that it was a “repentance from dead things” (animal sacrifices) in 6:1. Their falling away was not a return to, “Hey! Let’s go out and sin as much as possible” but rather them returning to the Levitical system of trying to deal with their sins that Christ already took care of once and for all. This puts Christ to an open shame.
The author of Hebrews states how Esau after much tears could not find a place of repentance in chapter 12. The passage had nothing to do with an after death experience but was simply saying that as Esau could not change Isaac’s mind about the blessing that was rightfully his, as they were to know that God will not change His mind concerning Jesus Christ. You (Jews back then) can return back all you like to the old system but God’s mind can and will never be changed.
These were people facing great persecution. They were tempted to return back and the author of Hebrews wanted them to not forsake gathering themselves together during that time. These Jews needed to know that drawing back was “perdition” that was nigh. This would be the same as me preaching in 2001, “To return back to the Twin Towers will result in death.”
The “saving of the soul” is referring to one’s physical life. The soul is what God breathed into man as he became a LIVING soul. It is unfortunate that every time a person sees or hears the word “save, saved, or salvation” that hellfire or the afterlife runs through their heads thanks to religion. The meaning here in Hebrews 10 is the preservation of one’s physical life. This is the enduring to the end to be saved you are reading about in Hebrews 10:39.
The saving of the soul is the preserving of one's life.
39 Butdewehēmeisareeiminotouofthosewhoshrinkbackhypostolēandareeislostapōleia,butallaareofthosewhoarefaithfulpistisandsoeispreserveperipoiēsistheirsoulpsychē. (Mounce Reverse-Interlinear New Testament).
The above gives the verse and its meaning from the Greek but what happens when we allow religion to add words NOWHERE stated in the verse or context to make us see it from their perspective? Look at the modern NLV and how they altered the verse drastically:
39 We are not of those people who turn back and are lost. Instead, we have faith to be saved from the punishment of sin.
Saved from the punishment of sin??? Hebrews 10 was about how to avoid punishment of sin??? I did not know that Hebrews 10 presented such a failure they call Jesus. Verse 39 in the NLV is nowhere near what was presented in the previous verses. Hebrews 10 presented sin as completely dealt with but this version makes it quite the opposite.
Hebrews 10 was the once for all sacrifice and how we are made holy once for all and perfected forever. How God remembers our sins no more because there is no more sin offering. This was how the author was seeking to plead to these Jews as a reason not to return back to the Temple because the blood of bulls and goats could never take away sin. Their sins were dealt with in full so why return to something that was impossible? The above translation simply read their hellish and wimpy Jesus interpretation into the verse. If you have an NLV then toss it out in the trash. You have to be careful of newer versions because some of them will alter verses to support their religious beliefs.
Now let's look at other versions that did not seek to stray as did the NLV:
39 But we are not of those who shrink back to destruction, but of those who have faith to the preserving of the soul. (NASV)
39 and we are not of those drawing back to destruction, but of those believing to a preserving of soul. (YLT)
39 But we are not they which withdraw ourselves unto perdition, but followfaith unto the conservation of the soul. (1599 Geneva Bible).
39 However, we are not the kind who shrink back and are destroyed; on the contrary, we keep trusting and thus preserve our lives! (Complete Jewish Bible)
Can salvation be lost? If we are defining it as a physical salvation then the answer is yes. However, nobody today is being warned of a coming destruction upon a Temple. Nobody is drawing back to a sacrificial system. Only religion will try to spiritualize such verses and make them apply to just about anything you do. I see verses from Hebrews ripped from its context to somehow mean you can lose salvation if you stop going to church. How you can apostasize and never be renewed to salvation nonsense. This is religion at its worst. Religion is spewing forth lies. Religion is also sounding warnings that would be equivalent to me today going to New York and warning people that the Twin Towers will be destroyed when clearly such a destruction is past.
I listen to these people yelling at street corners using Luke 13:5 "except ye repent...you will perish" as somehow referring to an after death experience inside a passage never talking about any after death experience. They preach it as though it was addressing the gospel of grace in the context. One needs to read the context to see who were being warned and to also notice that the perishing had NOTHING to do with a rejection of any death, burial, and resurrection gospel. The chapter began about Galileans blood shed at the hands of Pilate so the concern and the context had death in view. The "perishing" had this death in view (death only was in the context) and never some after death perishing where one never ultimately perishes according to hellfire lovers. The people warned in Luke 13 are no longer alive today. The vineyard was Israel and not the United Kingdom or America. Please see how "perish" was consistently used throughout the OT and maybe you will see the deceitfulness of religion and be done with them.
What Christ accomplished at Calvary can never be destroyed. Our unbelief does not make the "faith of" (faithfulness) God without effect (Romans 3:3). If we believe not is to know that Christ abides faithful. Jesus came to destroy the works of the devil and we can either believe that or live thinking that Jesus is helpless until we help Him. You can read my blogs on Gehenna and see that it addressed only the land of the living and not some after death experience:
In Adam all die but in Christ all shall be made alive. We can either believe it or twist it. Every knee shall bow and every tongue shall confess and we can either believe it or twist it. Jesus has taken away the sin of the world that we can either believe or twist. Jesus is the savior of the world that we can either believe or twist. Jesus is the propitiation for the sins of the whole world that we can either believe or twist.
We can either pat ourselves on our backs saying, “Whew! I am so glad that I did that thing called believing because it was only then God could forgive me and take me to heaven. Too bad and so sad for those who never get to hear this message. I am so thankful that I was born in a country that preaches this version of the gospel because I could have been born in a tribe doomed to hellfire.” What nonsense!
However, we can rejoice in the One who has taken away the sin of the world (John 1:29). Rejoice in the One who was reconciled to this world and is NOT imputing sin to the world that was only through the death of Him (2nd Cor. 5:19). We can read in 2nd Corinthians 5:14 that Christ died for all and that ALL died with Him, as we can either accept that "those that have died with Him shall live with Him" (2nd Timothy 2:11) as a reality.
You can selfishly rejoice in your, “I am so thankful I gave God the permission to forgive me” that contradicts 2ndCor. 5:19, but I prefer to never cheapen what He had accomplished for me. I had no freewill in Adam who brought death to all and the same “no freewill” is also implied in the Jesus who undid what the first Adam brought upon us.
Remember, eternal (aionion life) life is not immortality as the bible separates the two. Eternal life refers to the quality and immortality refers to the quantity. Eternal life is knowing Him (John 17:3). It is not the same as, "In Christ, all shall be made alive." We all shared in His death and we all share in His resurrection. Unbelievers are no worse than us. They simply will not experience the abundant life here but many do enjoy life far better than most professing believers.
Are you experiencing the abundant life or do unbelievers seem happier than you? If you believe unbelievers appear happier then you most likely are an unbeliever. I am not talking about finances and health. Unbelievers can be quite wealthy and healthy. If unbelievers appear to be at peace and happier than you then clearly what you believe is a depressing message that promotes bondage. If you take an unbeliever who appeared happy and now he/she becomes fearful, depressed, full of doubts and uncertainty, crying out to God because they constantly feel so sinful then your message is a lie.
I remember my sister who died from a malignant brain tumor writing questions for me on paper because the tumor affected her hearing. My religion instill so much fear into her that she had questions about her coming death. I gave her the best religious answers at the time but since insecurity (conditional statements) surrounded the comfort I sought to give her ended up not doing much. I was preaching my former Calvinism and Lordship Salvation nonsense to her at that time but did my very best to give her assurance and comfort that I knew I did not have personally at that time. That was in 1991. She died in January of 1992.
The gospel of grace is not a gospel of, "Do you want to go to heaven when you die?" as that is what religion says. The gospel of grace is the answer to your insecurities. The gospel of religion reinforces insecurities.
The gospel of grace is a fear not message. It is knowing that we are not rejected but accepted in the beloved, as He will never leave us or forsake us. Perfect love casts out all fear and that is something you will never find in religion. The gospel of grace is a message of joy unspeakable. The gospel of grace is a message of pure love. The gospel of grace is beholding no condemnation. The gospel of grace is beholding the love of Christ that passes knowledge. The gospel of grace is where we can boldly approach the throne of grace. The gospel of grace is where peace passes all understanding. The gospel of grace is where we behold no imperfections as we are perfected forever in Him. We no longer see ourselves as insignificant. We are complete in Him. We do not see ourselves as worthless pieces of sinful scum before God. We no longer have to hide in shame. We no longer have to try and cover things up anymore. We no longer have to try and be like God as was the sin of Adam and Eve. The gospel is that we are created after the image of Him in righteousness and true holiness. The gospel of grace is where we can see our God truly pleased with us as we are, and we can be a workman with such a glorious knowledge knowing we have nothing to be ashamed about. The gospel is where we have no threats hanging over our heads. The gospel reveals that as Christ is, so are we in this world. If you have seen the Son then you have seen the Father, but to see yourself is to see the Son. We have unity with the Father, Son, and Spirit. We are joined with Him. Beholding Him is how we are transformed (2nd Cor. 3:18). The gospel of grace reveals our infinite value. The gospel of grace reveals how we are the praise of His glory. The gospel of grace reveals how we are reconciled and never alienated, as alienation was only in our minds (Col. 1:21). He is not our enemy, but we are loved and cherished. Our sins are forgiven. The gospel reveals that we are the sons and daughters He always wanted. We are a good dream and never a bad dream. The gospel is the answer to our insecurities. We can cast all our insecurities/cares upon Him for He cares for us.
Living in fear, depression, and anxiety is never to be produced by the gospel but rather removed. Any insecurity you have is based on a lie and reinforced by religion. Any negative opinion you have of yourself does not come from God but religion. You have a faulty view of yourself. Do you have full assurance? If not, religious insecurity is preaching in your ear. Sometimes people are afraid (insecurity) to challenge the very thing they know is causing their insecurity (often it is the religious hell garbage).
One is the abundant life. It is life and peace. The other is death as such a life comes from the administration of death (Law). Does your religion or belief in God make you feel guilty, uncertain, scared and fearful, utterly sinful before God? Are you still reading articles on OSAS but still found no lasting relief? Do you think you have to preach the bad news before the good news to others? If so, you are preaching insecurity and you have yet to hear the good news. You are bound by religion/insecurity and probably are calling your experience freedom when your heart knows better.
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Are you fearful to challenge your beliefs? You will find the moment your religion discovers that you are challenging your fears and insecurities is when they will preach at you more insecurities. If they can implant fear then you will not challenge them. You will remain a prisoner. Try telling your church members that you are having doubts concerning hellfire. Tell them that you are studying books that teach there is no hell and see what happens. Be sure to see if they throw any insecurity message your way. See if they get very angry with you. Look for the signs of religious insecurity.
I am not into the OSAS debate because the whole message of how one supposedly gets OSAS is flawed. I believe they promote a works oriented gospel. This is why many of them ask, "Did I believe enough? Did I believe the right way? Did I believe the right gospel? Did I truly see Christ dying for my sins? Do I actually believe this gospel or am I just saying that to feel better? What if religion is correct and I must continuously believe? What if my works prove I am not saved? What if salvation can be lost? How do I know God actually saved me when I feel exactly the same? Why does God seem so distant from me? Is there some unconfessed sin in my life? Why do I feel so guilty?" Only the insecure ask such questions.
Insecurity keeps people from questioning their beliefs. Some get nervous or extremely angry (fear and anger often are connected) if someone comes along and preaches an opposing message. I have seen people get so nervous when hearing of a pastor of their same denomination that became an atheist after many years. Insecurity promotes blindness/closed minded people. I am not talking about getting annoyed with those who seek to disrupt a good conversation or those who just wish to argue. Paul admonished us against debates. However, I get those who do not want to hear anything against their precious hell. They will not care to get into a discussion with me and will often stop me short because they have this fear of what "no hell" would mean to them. It would mean the collapse of their religion. On the other hand, if a person does want to talk hell with me but simply will not answer my questions then I personally will stop the conversation because I know I am dealing with a closed minded person.
I do not believe in OSAS or eternal security as taught by religion. I do not have any fear that I will not be with family who did not believe the gospel. I do not bear such religious insecurities. This is why they struggle to think whatsoever things are true, lovely, and of a good report because their minds are preoccupied with sins, guilt, condemnation, hellfire, and so on.
My God is better than the religious god whose love fails. Nobody in scripture feared not being reunited with their loved ones. Such insecurity only exists in religion. The insecurity people have is what causes them to beat their kids into submission. I know of people punished by family, friends, and their church for questioning hell. Insecurity of any kind can bring the worst out in people. The abundant life is a freedom of our insecurities. Walk in love is a walk free of those insane religious insecurities. It is walking and enjoying life free from having a religious guilt and sin conscious mindset.
My God is better than the religious god whose love fails. Nobody in scripture feared not being reunited with their loved ones. Such insecurity only exists in religion. The insecurity people have is what causes them to beat their kids into submission. I know of people punished by family, friends, and their church for questioning hell. Insecurity of any kind can bring the worst out in people. The abundant life is a freedom of our insecurities. Walk in love is a walk free of those insane religious insecurities. It is walking and enjoying life free from having a religious guilt and sin conscious mindset.
Do you want to enjoy the abundant life or will fear keep you from questioning your pastor or upbringing?
Eternal Security should be the knowledge that, "God's love never fails. God's mercy fails not. Christ died for all. Christ is the propitiation for the sins of the whole world. Behold the Lamb of God that has taken away the sin of the world! In Christ, all shall be made alive. Christ died for His enemies. No condemnation in Christ Jesus. No alienation. Who is he that condemns (religion obviously) when Christ died? Nothing can separate us from His love." People need to hear "security" but without all the insane conditions that religion inserts back into it. Security is what will breed faith and love. Preaching conditions breeds doubt but preaching an already reality breeds faith and assurance.